riddle 7

Like the bridge in the story
We span two safer shores.

Our rhythm is quite clumsy
You might not stay upright.

Those who come to visit,
always decline to stay.

Please tell us who we are
and then be on your way.

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17 thoughts on “riddle 7

  1. “Like the bridge in the story”

    ~~ CarO ~~ Caput Draconis and Cauda Draconis, the bridge between two worlds; the two points in the Moon’s orbit where it cuts the plane of the Ecliptic.

    The bridge between worlds is ever perilous with its association with death and testing; and to cross it safely sorts the worthy from the unworthy. In cosmological myth, bridges lead from the realm of mortals to the abode of the gods. Zoroastrian myth tells of the Cinvat (‘separation’) bridge, ‘the holy bridge made by Mazda’ that stretches over hell to paradise. In Christian myth, the Pope is known as the ‘sovereign pontiff’, a title derived from that of the chief priest of pagan Rome, the Pontifex Maximus – literally, the ‘greatest bridge-builder’, the link between the divine and the mundane.

    “We span two safer shores”.

    ~~ CarO ~~ The ‘Nodal Line’ spans 180* of the Ecliptic across two polarities of the Zodiac.

    “Our rhythm is quite clumsy
    You might not stay upright.”

    ~~ CarO ~~ The ‘mean’ Node is always retrograde, but the motion of ‘true’ Node is very erratic, and subject to periodic variation: every 10 to 20 days or so changing it’s retrograde direction for a day or so of direct motion. It swivels around like a whirligig.

    “Those who come to visit,
    always decline to stay.”

    ~~ CarO ~~ The Moon’s orbit is not on the Ecliptic, but inclines at an average angle of 5* 08 to it; this plus the angle of the inclination of the Moon’s orbit to the earths’ Equator (declination) means that any planet on the zodiacal degree of the Nodes is very rarely on the same degree of declination :0)

    “Please tell us who we are
    and then be on your way.”

    Caput Draconis and Cauda Draconis, the two points of intersection of the Ecliptic, the bridge between the mundane and the divine.

    Love
    CarO

  2. Dear CarO,

    Thank you for your most informative solution. Your interpretation of the “bridge” is most interesting. Once again I am enclined to ask myself if I know the true answer! 🙂

    But alas, this is not what I was looking for.

    The bridge I am seeking is much more familiar.

    best wishes,
    and good luck in your solution search!

    Thomas

  3. Humph!

    Riddle Seven: Take 2

    Fortuna (the Lot of Fortune) and Spiritus (the Lot of Spirit)

    “Like the bridge in the story”

    ~~ CarO ~~ Same bridge as ‘Take 1” . In cosmological myth, bridges lead from the realm of mortals to the abode of the gods etc. :0)

    “We span two safer shores”.

    ~~ CarO ~~ The Lots are derived from each of the lights, which are solid bodies.

    “Our rhythm is quite clumsy
    You might not stay upright.”

    ~~ CarO ~~ Both Fortuna and Spiritus dash backwards and forwards around the chart as the angular relationship between the lights to the ascendant changes. Sometimes they are in the upper hemisphere and sometimes in the lower hemisphere.

    “Those who come to visit,
    always decline to stay.”

    ~~ CarO ~~ A planet never stays stationary on one degree long but either moves forwards or backwards along the ecliptic. Also planets are usually at a different declination to the celestial longitude of the Arabic parts ( that ‘declining’ must come into it somewhere for goodness sake?!)

    “Please tell us who we are
    and then be on your way.”

    Fortuna and Spiritus the ‘bridge’ that connects the world of matter to that of the soul.

    Love
    CarO
    .

  4. Hi Thomas,

    One possible solution is fixed star Deneb and the Summer triangle (Deneb, Vega, Altair).
    http://www.souledout.org/cosmology/highlights/sthighlights/summertriangle.html

    *Like the bridge in the story
    *We span two safer shores.
    In Chinese Mythology Deneb is the bridge of birds which temporarily spans the Celestial River of Stars (Milky way) in the story of “Weaving-Girl and the Herd-Boy” (Vega and Altair).

    *Our rhythm is quite clumsy.
    The fixed stars move very slowly through the Zodiac. Precession.

    *You might not stay upright.
    Deneb and Nashira in Cygnus are called “The 2 bending stars”.

    *Those who come to visit,
    *always decline to stay.
    Deneb has a 45 deg northern declination and was used by arab medieval navigators on the indian ocean.
    Is this a pun? “Decline to stay” for “constant declination”?

    *Please tell us who we are
    *and then be on your way.
    The ocean navigators named lunar mansions after the brightest star in the mansion. It was necessary for the Mariner navigator to identify the bright stars , to be able to determine latitude, and know their way.

  5. Dear Lea!

    Welcome!

    Just as with CarO’s answers I am almost inclined to think that maybe I got the riddle wrong! 😉

    The star lore that you have mentioned is very good.

    Yes, decline, is indeed a clue, but not in the way you are using it. You are getting closer.

    best wishes,
    Thomas

  6. Like the bridge in the story

    ~~ CarO ~~ Somewhere over the Rainbow tra-la-la-la!

    We span two safer shores.

    The Summer Solstice and the Winter Solstice (or in other words O* Cancer and 0* Capricorn :0)

    Our rhythm is quite clumsy
    You might not stay upright.

    When the Sun is at the Summer Solstice at O* Cancer it is above the Celestial Equator and when it is at the Winter Solstice 0* Capricorn it is below the Celestial Equator; In the North you are standing the right way up, but when you visit Vicki in the Antipodes you are standing upside down :0)

    Those who come to visit,
    always decline to stay.

    The Ecliptic is inclined to the C, Equator by approx 23*.26 degrees, and so any planet visiting 0* Cancer would be at approx 23* 26 North Declination and any planet posited on 0* Capricorn would be at apprxo 23* 26 South Declination.

    Please tell us who we are
    and then be on your way.

    The Summer Solstice and the Winter Solstice. The Sun stands still for a day or two and then goes on its way!

    Phweeew! Now I can go to bed :0)

    Love
    CarO

  7. Humph! You mean I was wrong again? Hummmm, how about:

    “Out of Bounds” ( when a planet is further north than 23* 26 north delincation and 23* 26 degrees south declination)

    Like the Bridge in the story
    We span two safer shores

    ~~ CarO~~ Declination is the 3rd dimension of our charts and measures the distance any celestial body has with the celestial Equator. There are 6 or 7 degrees that are ‘Out of bounds’ which lie each side of the inclination of the Ecliptic to the Equator of 23* 26 degrees, and so any planet lyng further North or South to Declination to 23* 26 will be in the ‘Out of Bounds’ zone which goes up to around 30* N/S

    Our rythym is quite clumsy
    You may not stay upright

    ~~ CarO ~~ Delination is either North (the right way up) or South (upside down :0) It is erraticly related to the Ecliptic.

    Those who come to visit
    always decline to stay

    ~~ CarO ~~ any planet on the Ecliptic is also on a degree of declination, and will therefore ‘decline’ to stay.

    Please tell us who we are
    And then be on your way.

    “The Two portions of the celestial sphere that are ‘Out of Bounds’ to a planet.

    Howzat then . . . ?

  8. Greetings CarO,

    Hmmph. Thomas and his riddles.
    He should have said that every child in Kindergarten, even as far back as Rome, has sung about this bridge one time or the other and that what this bridge is doing is the clue.

    your servant,
    H. N.

  9. Well, I have been singing “London Bridge is Falling Down” for the past 2 days, but couldn’t see how the degrees of Fall can straddle two safer shores!!

    Unless it is the degrees of Exaltation and Fall that are totally opposite each other? Naw can’t be that. Must be some other bridge . . . . I will put my thinking cap on again. . . .

    grumble grumble
    CarO

  10. I can’t make ‘fall’ fit 😦

    Is it ‘Sect’ as in the Day and Night Sects?:

    Like the Bridge in the story
    We span two safer shores

    ~~ CarO~~ The Ascendant and Descendant axis span across the safe shores of the horizon.

    Our rhythm is quite clumsy
    You may not stay upright

    ~~ CarO ~~ owing to diurnal rotation a planet whizzes in and out of sect according to the time of day, and as soon as it falls over the horizon at the descendant it will change sect.

    Those who come to visit
    always decline to stay

    ~~ CarO ~~ ‘decline’ may be a red herring. Those who are ‘in sect’ will soon be carried ‘out of sect’ by diurnal rotation as they appear over the ascendant or fall below the descendant (Serves them jolly well right too for being in such a difficult riddle!)

    Please tell us who we are
    And then be on your way.

    “Day and Night Sect”

    :0)
    CarO

  11. Pitted or deep degrees ?

    “Degrees deep or pitted … have this signification, that if either the Moon or the degree ascending or lord of the Ascendant be in any of them, it shows the man at a stand in the question he asks, not knowing which way to turn himself and that he had need of help to bring him into a better condition; for as a man cast into a ditch doth not easily get out without help, so no more can this querent in the case he is without assistance. “(CA., p.118)

  12. What the heck is he talking about Lea?
    Salve = saved or solved
    Pont = bridge
    Lond = London?
    Cad = Cadent

    Well, I got London bridge is falling down days ago, but it doesn’t go across the Pitted/Puteal degrees does it?

    There is a ditch either side of the Puteal degrees but OH YES, they ‘fall’ in the darned pits don’t they!!

    ROFL Very neat Thomas!!

    :0)
    CarO

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